• Welcome to the ShrimperZone forums.
    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which only gives you limited access.

    Existing Users:.
    Please log-in using your existing username and password. If you have any problems, please see below.

    New Users:
    Join our free community now and gain access to post topics, communicate privately with other members, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and free. Click here to join.

    Fans from other clubs
    We welcome and appreciate supporters from other clubs who wish to engage in sensible discussion. Please feel free to join as above but understand that this is a moderated site and those who cannot play nicely will be quickly removed.

    Assistance Required
    For help with the registration process or accessing your account, please send a note using the Contact us link in the footer, please include your account name. We can then provide you with a new password and verification to get you on the site.

Corporal Punishment for Venables


  • Total voters
    41
  • Poll closed .

GBJ

The Font of all Knowledge from Russia⭐
Staff member
Joined
Nov 2, 2008
Messages
12,271
Location
Grays
Venables was, of course, just a ten year old child when he committed his first unspeakable crime.Worboys wasn't.

Yeah see that excuse doesn't wash with me. He was a 10-year-old with enough compos mentis, to lure a child miles away, and then subject him to lengthy torture, before tying him to a train track. It was, and still is Britains most shocking crime, and the age of the perpetrators is irrelevant.
 

Tangled up in Blue

Certified Senior Citizen⭐
Joined
May 24, 2004
Messages
31,390
Location
Sant Cugat del Vallès
Yeah see that excuse doesn't wash with me. He was a 10-year-old with enough compos mentis, to lure a child miles away, and then subject him to lengthy torture, before tying him to a train track. It was, and still is Britains most shocking crime, and the age of the perpetrators is irrelevant.

Not an excuse.Merely a fact.
 

GBJ

The Font of all Knowledge from Russia⭐
Staff member
Joined
Nov 2, 2008
Messages
12,271
Location
Grays
Not an excuse.Merely a fact.

Do you think that Venables should be allowed to roam freely in society, without constant watch, due to the fact he was only 10, when he murdered James Bulger?
 

OldBlueLady

Junior Blues Coordinator⭐
Joined
Dec 27, 2007
Messages
48,105
Location
Benfleet
Yeah see that excuse doesn't wash with me. He was a 10-year-old with enough compos mentis, to lure a child miles away, and then subject him to lengthy torture, before tying him to a train track. It was, and still is Britains most shocking crime, and the age of the perpetrators is irrelevant.


It's funny how you get a "feeling" about things, I always felt it was Robert Thompson who was the leader in all that, but the fact that he has, seemingly, continued to live an unblemished lifestyle since release, and the continuation of deviant behaviour by Venables has made me reassess my original thoughts.
 

* ORM *

Emma Bunton's No. 1 stalker, Adam Barretts No. 1 f
Joined
Nov 7, 2003
Messages
17,709
Location
Flying the flag for SUFC in Sai Kung, Hong Kong
What we really need to do (but would never happen) is rip up the criminal justice system and start again. Clear statutory sentencing guidelines for all forms of crime, harsher parole terms, meaningful community sentences for lesser offences keeping people that don't need to be in prison, out of prison. Make prison a place where criminals don't want to be. No internet access, no mobile phones for example. I'm all up for giving people a second chance but for the likes of Venables he has had that and more. A prison cell with a toilet should be his lot and he should be grateful for that. Enough of this bloody liberalism! Biggest problem I see is society wants to be tough but society isn't prepared to pay for it to be done.
 

EastStandBlue

Life President
Joined
May 29, 2005
Messages
15,481
It's funny how you get a "feeling" about things, I always felt it was Robert Thompson who was the leader in all that, but the fact that he has, seemingly, continued to live an unblemished lifestyle since release, and the continuation of deviant behaviour by Venables has made me reassess my original thoughts.

Surely this serves as big a condemnation of the death penalty as anything posted on this thread so far?
 

OldBlueLady

Junior Blues Coordinator⭐
Joined
Dec 27, 2007
Messages
48,105
Location
Benfleet
Surely this serves as big a condemnation of the death penalty as anything posted on this thread so far?
Why? As children there is no way they would have been executed, if the death penalty had still existed. I have always said when advocating in favour of the death penalty that it should be used if there is absolutely NO SHADOW of a doubt in a person's guilt, as in the case of Lee Rigby's killers, for instance, and Ian Brady, Myra Hindley, Peter Sutcliffe etc.

We were never party to the full details of who the ringleader was out of Thompson and Venables so cannot judge, as I said, it was just the feeling I had at the time.
 

C C Csiders

Life President
Joined
Apr 27, 2005
Messages
12,192
Location
On the journey to spiritual enlightenment (via the
Why? As children there is no way they would have been executed, if the death penalty had still existed. I have always said when advocating in favour of the death penalty that it should be used if there is absolutely NO SHADOW of a doubt in a person's guilt, as in the case of Lee Rigby's killers, for instance, and Ian Brady, Myra Hindley, Peter Sutcliffe etc.

We were never party to the full details of who the ringleader was out of Thompson and Venables so cannot judge, as I said, it was just the feeling I had at the time.

How can you have convictions that lead to a judge's sentencing being down to how guilty someone actually is?
 

rigsby

Life President⭐
Joined
Oct 12, 2014
Messages
14,450
How can you have convictions that lead to a judge's sentencing being down to how guilty someone actually is?

Perhaps the jury could do a sort of post trial report and mark each defendant out of 10. Highlighting strengths and weaknesses for the defence and prosecution.

In fact to why not leap into the 21st century and make crime finally pay.......High Court Iplayer anyone?
 

Firestorm

Pedant
Joined
Oct 25, 2003
Messages
15,217
Location
Immersed in the accounts
Why? As children there is no way they would have been executed, if the death penalty had still existed. I have always said when advocating in favour of the death penalty that it should be used if there is absolutely NO SHADOW of a doubt in a person's guilt, as in the case of Lee Rigby's killers, for instance, and Ian Brady, Myra Hindley, Peter Sutcliffe etc.

We were never party to the full details of who the ringleader was out of Thompson and Venables so cannot judge, as I said, it was just the feeling I had at the time.

So basically, if the Judge instructs the Jury to accept a Majority, as opposed to a Unanimous verdict , that mean that there was enough doubt for a more lenient sentence.

There was a lawyer on the case who had Thompson down as the evil one of the pair
 

rigsby

Life President⭐
Joined
Oct 12, 2014
Messages
14,450
So basically, if the Judge instructs the Jury to accept a Majority, as opposed to a Unanimous verdict , that mean that there was enough doubt for a more lenient sentence.

There was a lawyer on the case who had Thompson down as the evil one of the pair

Not necessarily the case. Depends on who is amongst the jury, which why in a modern society the system is completely flawed.
 

Ricky Otto

President⭐
Joined
Mar 8, 2007
Messages
6,597
Location
Chelmsford
On evidence it seems there is zero chance of rehabilitation and no punishment deters him from his sickening desires. The death penalty is something I certainly don't agree with as the norm, but I think the call for it in specialist cases where rehabilitation has not worked and it is clear the offender poses a permanent danger is reasonable.

On the subject of paltry punishments has anybody watched the documentary on BBC iplayer at moment, Acid attack? A really shocking story and the fact the girl who did it only got 12 years and could be out in 6 after a calculated plan to ruin a "friends" life because of jealousy is sickening. Not something I'd usually watch but my other half was watching it and it was a shocking story, well worth watching and Naomi Oni is inspiring.
 

Gt Yarmouth Shrimper

President⭐
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,933
I have always said when advocating in favour of the death penalty that it should be used if there is absolutely NO SHADOW of a doubt in a person's guilt, as in the case of Lee Rigby's killers, for instance, and Ian Brady, Myra Hindley, Peter Sutcliffe etc.

What would you have said to Stefan Kiszko's mother Charlotte after you'd had him strung up?
 

rigsby

Life President⭐
Joined
Oct 12, 2014
Messages
14,450
So to change the question slightly what if like some US states the victims family had a say in the sentence. If someone had murdered your child and the choice was life sentence with possible parole after 15 years or the death sentence what would you choose ?
 

EastStandBlue

Life President
Joined
May 29, 2005
Messages
15,481
Why? As children there is no way they would have been executed, if the death penalty had still existed. I have always said when advocating in favour of the death penalty that it should be used if there is absolutely NO SHADOW of a doubt in a person's guilt, as in the case of Lee Rigby's killers, for instance, and Ian Brady, Myra Hindley, Peter Sutcliffe etc.

We were never party to the full details of who the ringleader was out of Thompson and Venables so cannot judge, as I said, it was just the feeling I had at the time.

Because it highlights the subjectivity of the criminal justice system. While an experienced judge probably wouldn’t leap to the same ill-informed conclusions as you might have done, they are still human. Of course there are sentencing guidelines, but where do you set the limit for what warrants execution? What if there are mitigating circumstances, and how are those taken into equation? We saw last week with the Worboys case that sentencing and parole conditions are murky and imperfect, and I’d be uncomfortable if such a system was used to decide which convicted criminals lived or died.
 

Benfleet A1

Hector Of The House
Joined
Jan 19, 2007
Messages
8,340
Location
Slade Prison
So to change the question slightly what if like some US states the victims family had a say in the sentence. If someone had murdered your child and the choice was life sentence with possible parole after 15 years or the death sentence what would you choose ?

My child? It would never even get to court.
 

Blueronron

Manager
Joined
Oct 18, 2012
Messages
3,354
Location
Ooooh Doctor
So to change the question slightly what if like some US states the victims family had a say in the sentence. If someone had murdered your child and the choice was life sentence with possible parole after 15 years or the death sentence what would you choose ?

That depends on your faith, whether to forgive or seek retribution

UTS
 

rigsby

Life President⭐
Joined
Oct 12, 2014
Messages
14,450
Because it highlights the subjectivity of the criminal justice system. While an experienced judge probably wouldn’t leap to the same ill-informed conclusions as you might have done, they are still human. Of course there are sentencing guidelines, but where do you set the limit for what warrants execution? What if there are mitigating circumstances, and how are those taken into equation? We saw last week with the Worboys case that sentencing and parole conditions are murky and imperfect, and I’d be uncomfortable if such a system was used to decide which convicted criminals lived or died.

OBL was never claiming to be informed or she would ever find anyone guilty on a hunch.....But of course you know that, your just having a dig.

Even when we did have hanging, mitigating circumstances were always taken into account or the Home secretary could overrule a death sentence etc. Even in WW1 the vast majority of death sentences passed in a military court were commuted to life, with most released after the war.
 
Top