Where the Country really has gone wrong.

[SUFC Forever]

Well, other than the economic crisis - I want to touch on how it's treating it's veterans of wars and conflicts.

Next year, 06/06/2009, is the 65th anniversary of D-day, possibly the most important day in the modern history of our country and possibly the world.

That day, people like my Grandad, rushed ashore on beaches laid with wire and mines and bullets whizzing passed their ears, and people dropped from the skies out of burning planes knowing their life expectancy was less than 3 hours, if they survived the landning that is.

Next year, is the last major anniversary many of these HEROES will probably be able to make - A campaign was started to get as many over there as possible, with the help of government fundning...... Err no, not that last part actually. D-day was mainly the brits, yanks and canadians... The US and Canadian governments have pledged to help return heroes to the final resting place of many of their friends, round trips over 10,000 miles involved.. Where the brisith government cannot help ours cross 24 miles of water.

What a way to treat these heroes eh? What a **** take?
I feel the thing that takes the p!ss is the generations that have inherited their 'rights' and 'freedoms' from the likes of the old and bold when serving one's country meant fighting for one's survival and way of life kitted out with ammo boots, bolt action rifle and boyonet!

The thought of what the people endured for us makes my skin crawl and brings a lump to my throat. But regardless of this I am struck by the humility, humour and funnily enough, "normal-ness" of all the veterens I've come across. How they came through it I don't know - they are certainly stronger than me. Unfortunately they number fewer by the day; appreciate them while you still can.

But will the goverment do it? No... Of course they wont.

It makes my blood boil to think in 30/40 years time, the repeat process will be happening with current serving members. As we approach remembrance day, i urge, nay, i encourage you ALL - to buy poppies, thank the sellers, and if you ever see a hero, bloody well shake their hand and thank them - they gave it all, so we could have everything.

More should be done by the governments of the day to ensure that those that fought and toiled in these generations are allowed to live out their lives with comfort and dignity.

A little story -

Ted was in Royal Signals and ended up in the back of a glider on D Day, wrote a short book called "straight from the Horsa's" mouth which is a great account of his wartime life. He went on to serve through the the late 50's and then left to return to Sunderland. Eric was in Royal Artillery and went ashore on D Day, Eric kept a diary and just about every page contains the name of a friend who was killed. What always gets me thinking about these two lads is the fact that nothing phases them apart from the dissapointment at how the country is going and the "yoof" of today, no respect etc. Ted is a good old boy who doffs his cap for ladies in the street, that is until he got a load of verbal from a chav scroat. Eric was mugged last year and died early this year.

That ladies and Gentlemen, is where this country really is going wrong -

I will end on politics - Only in this country, will the families of suicide bombers get more compensation, more care, than a Soldier serving, or an ex soldier who served their country, so Suicide bomber families have the "right" to compensation.

Never thought I would ever be able to say this about anything you write here "Wet Pants" but agreed on every word there.

Very well put and it just goes to show that when you are not acting the a*sehole here you can actually write well and eloquently on serious subjects.

This country has been sold out big time by successive goverments since the war and now it is too far gone for anybody ever to be able to halt it's slide.

Joan Collins (a woman I detest by the way) made a very fine point when being interviewed on TV recently when she stated that "England is a great country that has been totally ruined by dreadful politicians" which I agree with 100%.

If I could green rep you J I would - something else I never thought I'd ever say and that certainly is a fact.

 

[Desert Shrimper]

this country has allowed or lured mass immigration which has/will strangle the life out of every single citizen.

the average working person is appalled at the level of comforts offered to persons who have never paid a single penny into the system.

the simple facts are this country is a tiny island where the population for many years was at a steady 56 million,today the goverment admit they have little idea of exact numbers anything from 61 million to approx 65 million.

my question is what happens if this country experiences a severe drought?

Only just seen this but **** me you're hilarious. Are you Alf Garnett in disguise? Is this some sort of wind up? Check the stats if you like, I'll dig them out if you want but percentage wise there are many, many, many more Brits scrounging off the state than there are immigrants. 99% of them come here seeking to better themselves by means of work and don't have the nouse to play the system in the way you seem to believe (or your ****** tabloid propaganda/Grays grapevine has made you believe.) Yes, the UK is in a mess but ever thought it might be down to a bit more than the colour of a person's skin or their country of origin? Get a life mate, it's not 1972 and people travel all over the world for work which includes the UK, so unless you'd prefer the Aryan Nation to resurrect itself and reform in Grays you're a bit ****ed. I'm not saying that immigration has been perfectly managed and we're all one big happy family because we're clearly not (people like you show that) but that has more to do with poor integration, not the fact that we're somehow the master race and anyone coming here are just coming to rip us off. Change the record, I preferred you when you were imagining 20,000 people turning up for Billy Best's comeback.....

 

[graysblue]

wear your rose tinted specs mr desert man,however when the population hits 75 million and severe drought occurs liberal bleeding hearts such as yourself will wonder what happened.

 

[Lord Football]

Let's cut straight to the racist crap shall we?

Immigrants:- To claim benefit an immigrant must be here legally. An illegal immigrant is not here legally, does not have an NI number, cannot legally work and therefore cannot legally pay tax. Consequently as a non tax payer, an illegal immigrant is not able to receive benefit. Indeed, if an illegal immigrant did attempt to claim benefits they would be sent to a detention centre to await probable transportation.

Benefits:- Anyone who receives benefits has gone through the process of claiming benefit. And regardless of what you might read in The Sun or The Mail, that process is fairly stringent. To claim benefits the recipient must be a tax payer, ie have an NI number and must be availalbe for work (unless the benefit is disability related).

One of the things the right wing media pedal, and the BNP twist, is the immigrants / benefits line. It has no basis in fact and is simply a scare tactic.

 

[MK Shrimper]

wear your rose tinted specs mr desert man,however when the population hits 75 million and severe drought occurs liberal bleeding hearts such as yourself will wonder what happened.

Severe drought? Did you not see the lack of sun this summer?

 

[Lord Football]

Oh, and Graysblue

The number of legal immigrants coming into the UK in 2007 was 124855.

Here is the Government report on Immigration.
http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs08/hosb1008.pdf

And here is a report on emigration (which is the number of people leaving the UK)
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/pdfdir/emig1107.pdf

You will see from that the number leaving is 400000

I'll leave you to do the maths.

 

[steveo]

Oh, and Graysblue

The number of legal immigrants coming into the UK in 2007 was 124855.

Here is the Government report on Immigration.
http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs08/hosb1008.pdf

And here is a report on emigration (which is the number of people leaving the UK)
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/pdfdir/emig1107.pdf

You will see from that the number leaving is 400000

I'll leave you to do the maths.

I didn't read the report but i'm guessing most of the people leaving the country have money and most coming in dont, but have in fact come here to earn their fortune. Problem is, a lot of them, especially Eastern Europeans, send most of their money home, so it leaves the country. If someone arrives here and seeks asylum, and stay, they have probably come with nothing so are given housing and benefits. Also people form other European countries can come here legally and use the national health service having never contributed a penny to it in their lives.

So Lord Football, everything isn't as bright and rosy and as simple as you make out. Blaming the right wing press and pretending everything is really ok is getting a bit boring now.

 

[graysblue]

I didn't read the report but i'm guessing most of the people leaving the country have money and most coming in dont, but have in fact come here to earn their fortune. Problem is, a lot of them, especially Eastern Europeans, send most of their money home, so it leaves the country. If someone arrives here and seeks asylum, and stay, they have probably come with nothing so are given housing and benefits. Also people form other European countries can come here legally and use the national health service having never contributed a penny to it in their lives.

So Lord Football, everything isn't as bright and rosy and as simple as you make out. Blaming the right wing press and pretending everything is really ok is getting a bit boring now.

agreed 100%

sadly people believe the goverment propaganda machine and swallow the bait hook line and seeker.

in addition to the above this goverment has openly admitted they have little idea of the number of illegal immigrants,your view illegals cannot find work is a tad boring because they often have forged documents. ie the 51 illegals who worked at the tesco warehouse.

 

[graysblue]

Let's cut straight to the racist crap shall we?

Immigrants:- To claim benefit an immigrant must be here legally. An illegal immigrant is not here legally, does not have an NI number, cannot legally work and therefore cannot legally pay tax. Consequently as a non tax payer, an illegal immigrant is not able to receive benefit. Indeed, if an illegal immigrant did attempt to claim benefits they would be sent to a detention centre to await probable transportation.

Benefits:- Anyone who receives benefits has gone through the process of claiming benefit. And regardless of what you might read in The Sun or The Mail, that process is fairly stringent. To claim benefits the recipient must be a tax payer, ie have an NI number and must be availalbe for work (unless the benefit is disability related).

One of the things the right wing media pedal, and the BNP twist, is the immigrants / benefits line. It has no basis in fact and is simply a scare tactic.

could you explain why the lady and her 5 kids are being housed in a swanky mansion which is costing the british taxpayer 170k per year.

maybe you could explain how the extremist guy could afford to pay 4k for his daughter to have a boob job,courtesy of the dole

maybe you might be able to explain why immigrants have been paid between 22k up to 54k to move from london to thurrock

the bill is totting up and up

 

[Lord Football]

Steveo - you've not read the report? Suggest you do, before you comment on it. It details the number of asylum seekers - successful and otherwise. That would answer part of your post. 23000 people applied for asylum in 2007, of those 3545 were granted asylum. Thats about half the number of people at Roots Hall on Saturday. Most immigrants come from the Americas.

It's funny you know. When I was a kid everyone said the Asians sent their money home to their families. Now they say Europeans do. I've not found a statistic that proves or disproves either argument - and if one existed I would find it. Therefore, I'll assume there is no truth in either statement.

You do also of course know that if it was not for migrants workers we wouldn't have an NHS. That's been proven time and time again by various organisations; inc quite a good exposes by Panorama and Channel 4.

Graysblue. It is a shame you haven't read or understood my post. I was quite specific when I said "cannot legally work". Of course illegal immigrants do work, but they do so illegally, away from the tax system. This means they cannot claim benefit as they are not paying tax. If they are using false ID (as the 51 at Tescos were), then the person who they are pretending to be has the tax record and only they could claim benefit. Of course the jobs these illegals do are generally under minimum wage, most would be described as "sweat shop" or "slave labour". Quite a lot end up in the sex trade.

Sorry to burst both your bubbles with some facts, but that is life.


Sadly, there are still sufficient people out there who wish to pedal the differences in our cultures. I pretty much take everything I read with a pinch of salt. There was a story in one of the papers in the week that Muslims had complained about a story in Eastenders where a Muslim had broken the fast in Ramadam. When you read past the headlines, it wasn't actually Muslims, it was "people" and of a total audience of 8 million, there were just 117 complaints. Yet this made the news. Ask yourselves why it did.....

 

[Lord Football]

could you explain why the lady and her 5 kids are being housed in a swanky mansion which is costing the british taxpayer 170k per year.

maybe you could explain how the extremist guy could afford to pay 4k for his daughter to have a boob job,courtesy of the dole

maybe you might be able to explain why immigrants have been paid between 22k up to 54k to move from london to thurrock

the bill is totting up and up

Sorry, you'll need to help me here. I've taken a very quick look at the BBC website and can't find anything at all on the above stories.

I am vaguely aware of the top one, one of the red tops had it front page today or yesterday, but little or no comment on the web.

No idea what the others are about, got any links?

 

[graysblue]

Steveo - you've not read the report? Suggest you do, before you comment on it. It details the number of asylum seekers - successful and otherwise. That would answer part of your post. 23000 people applied for asylum in 2007, of those 3545 were granted asylum. Thats about half the number of people at Roots Hall on Saturday. Most immigrants come from the Americas.

It's funny you know. When I was a kid everyone said the Asians sent their money home to their families. Now they say Europeans do. I've not found a statistic that proves or disproves either argument - and if one existed I would find it. Therefore, I'll assume there is no truth in either statement.

You do also of course know that if it was not for migrants workers we wouldn't have an NHS. That's been proven time and time again by various organisations; inc quite a good exposes by Panorama and Channel 4.

Graysblue. It is a shame you haven't read or understood my post. I was quite specific when I said "cannot legally work". Of course illegal immigrants do work, but they do so illegally, away from the tax system. This means they cannot claim benefit as they are not paying tax. If they are using false ID (as the 51 at Tescos were), then the person who they are pretending to be has the tax record and only they could claim benefit. Of course the jobs these illegals do are generally under minimum wage, most would be described as "sweat shop" or "slave labour". Quite a lot end up in the sex trade.

Sorry to burst both your bubbles with some facts, but that is life.


Sadly, there are still sufficient people out there who wish to pedal the differences in our cultures. I pretty much take everything I read with a pinch of salt. There was a story in one of the papers in the week that Muslims had complained about a story in Eastenders where a Muslim had broken the fast in Ramadam. When you read past the headlines, it wasn't actually Muslims, it was "people" and of a total audience of 8 million, there were just 117 complaints. Yet this made the news. Ask yourselves why it did.....

intergration has failed for the past 50 years in this country,certain creeds hate other creeds and so on,the misguided assumption is to expect these people to live side by side in harmony,hence in major cities people are being murdered by ethnic persons simply because the victim was from a different creed.

the term "white flight" was born many years ago and its very to the fore today,london has the fastest white flight syndrome to date,its expected within a few years london will have a 50/50 split which will further increase in the ethnic favour,indeed last week a report stated the london population had increased by 500,000 in recent years due to immigration.

at the next election labour will be slaughtered and possibly never regain power,labours problem has been immigration which voters will never forgive or forget.

 

[steveo]

I've not found a statistic that proves or disproves either argument - and if one existed I would find it

Speak to some then. These people are out there.

You do also of course know that if it was not for migrants workers we wouldn't have an NHS.

Speculation at best. If there was a massive shortfall in workers, the pay would have to increase to attract them. You cant say we wouldnt have an NHS because you dont know. It like me saying if Southend sign Fabregas they will win the Premiership within 5 years. Not going to happen so we will never know.

 

[graysblue]

the NHS "bank staff" which had a massive percentage of ethnic workers doing as little as possible for decent money.

these workers were mainly agency staff with the agencies charging high hourly rates,2 years ago the annual bill for the bank had risen to over 1 billion pounds,this year it appears these agency staff are now being scaled down.

pal of mine works as a manager at an essex hospital,he is one of the nicest guys you could ever meet yet he is appalled at the level of people who appear for their shift often late and want to do as little as possible,off course not all of these were the same ie workshy.

i find it amazing people refuse to see what is going on in this country.

 

[J]

Lord Football,

Part of me died July 7th 2005. Another part died last year, after the glasgow attack.

It's different from when the IRA (Scum) Were doing it. However, the Islamic supporters of terrorism from that faith are frightening. One day, as i have said before, this country will finally surrender, and the Islamists that have said "The crescent will fly over london.." will eventually be proved right. I fear for myself, my family and my country, Islam has been a developing ground for terrorism on these shores, and i for one, do not want it. The country, could quite easily descend into war, if there were as many English nationalists and activists. as there were Islamic fundementalists.

One thing Lord Football, although i fear it is not far off, that this country will eventually be a haven and breeding ground for terrorism (if it isn't already) I, and i know many others will never surrender this country and the love i (we) have for it. I love Sunday mornings, being able to walk along the westcliff parade, Passed the Cenotaph, the old bandstand, look out to Kent, and think, that people have given service for the country, so i and others can have these freedoms, they didn't give service so my values and freedoms could be taken away as they are gradually doing so.

 

[graysblue]

10 years ago we lived 30 yards from an asian shop,these people were decent hardworking honest and upstanding,myself and family often went to their gaff for food and drinks and they often came to ours.

we never ever looked at the colour of their skin,we regarded them as mates.

labour then came into power and bullied the masses into their way of thinking,for us to be constantly told you cannot say certain things for fear of being branded racist was in all honesty insane.

labour have treated us like little school kids with their big stick approach and personally i think people have had enough.

l

 

[undercovershrimper]

im sorry but with the 10,000 character limit on posts, i cant fit in my views!

 

[Lord Football]

Steveo - I've spoken to plenty of Asians. And they don't send their money "home". But I tend to work on facts rather than opinion. If you like I'll befriend a view Poles and Czechs and ask them. The real problem with Eastern Europeans is that generally they are happy to work for less pay than the British - especially in the building trade. That does have an effect on the British workforce and does need to be addressed.

Your comments on the NHS actually show what you do know. If you don't believe me read the work by a guy call John Lister. I shared a rostrum with him once, frightening stuff.

Graysblue - I am not a member of the Labour Party; nor do I suspect I will vote for it come the next Election. If you want a discussion on the lunacy of certain elements of political correctness, make a thread. I may surprise you. What we can agree is that some of the comments from the Pink & Fluffy Brigade about use of words like "blackboard" probably set race relations back about 20 years.

J - Since 911 there have been two terrorist attacks on this country - both amateurish jobs - carried out by people best described as "wannabe terrorists". Sadly the first set killed people. It's hardly a hotbed, but we should be vigilent against all possible forms of terrorism be they Continuity IRA, Al Qaeda, Animal Rights or whatever.

I do see the differences between the Islamics and IRA. For a starter the IRA were organised, regularly killed, openly collected financies and were white.

The real terrorism is the on-going rape of Iraq. And every day that passes in this war more potential extremists are born. Those of us with vision said this before the tanks trolled in and the missiles reigned down. It's now a vicious circle and I don't see how it can end now without yet more pointless bloodshed.

I think the Bible says "You reap as you sow".

 

[steveo]

Problem is, a lot of them, especially Eastern Europeans, send most of their money home, so it leaves the country.

I didnt mention Asians. You are obviously so busy telling people how you "work on facts" you didnt manage to read the facts of my post properly.

Maybe before dismissing my post as non factual maybe you could find out more about how people from Poland and other eastern European countries live.


With regard to your post about more people leaving than coming in,
the Office for National Statistics say:

Ten years from now, there will be 65 million people in the UK - an increase of five million - and by 2031, the population will be over 70 million, the Office for National Statistics (ONS) said.

Your comments on the NHS actually show what you do know

As I previously posted, your claim about the NHS is speculation. You cant know for certain it would definitely happen, and if the John Lister you shared a rostrum is the one who campaigns for socialist changes worldwide, I wouldnt expect him to say anything different.

Stating things like "But I tend to work on facts rather than opinion" just makes you look like some sort of pompous twit. I suspect you mean you work on facts that suit your argument. Go and get you car washed and have a chat to the fellas washing it. You might learn something about real immigrants.

 

[graysblue]

the eastern bloc workers who i know all send cash back home.

they have told me that back home the average worker can only expect £200 per month in wages,they are here for a few more years where they can return back home with enough cash to buy property.

these people are seem decent enough,yet they say england is a dirty country which is fair enough i suppose.