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When defending corners should we....

  • bring everyone back

    Votes: 1 2.3%
  • leave 1 or more upfield

    Votes: 43 97.7%

  • Total voters
    44

GBJ

The Font of all Knowledge from Russia⭐
Staff member
Joined
Nov 2, 2008
Messages
12,400
Location
Grays
Not sure if this has been covered before? Anyway, what's people's take on defending corners? I've noticed that we tend to bring everyone back into and on the edge of the 18-yard box. For me, this is a bit of a crap tactic. It encourages the opposition team to pile more men forward and it allows for zero restbite should the ball be cleared, as it just come straight back in.

IMO we have to be leaving at least one, possibly two pacey players up by the halfway line. This inturn gives an outlet if/when the ball is cleared, plus means the opposition have to leave two, three possibly four players back to cover.

Discuss...
 

SARF

Director
Joined
Aug 9, 2004
Messages
2,329
I would like to see us leave 3 players on the halfway line for the hoof clearance.. but im sure prozone or some other Z stat thing will show that less goals are conceded when everyone stands in the 6 yard box or something
 

haveaguiness

Coach
Joined
Apr 3, 2007
Messages
694
There are positive and negatives to both, depends on the manager and the players available.

If you call everyone back and flood the box, the opposition team will naturally send more players forward. This creates far too many players within a small area and it is more likely for the defensive team to get a free kick for a foul on a defender, or more often than not on the goalie. Also the lack of space means that if the ball drops it is easier to close down a shot because someone should be close enough. On the downside as you say if you clear the ball it comes back pretty quick, but again you should have enough bodies back to cope with that. The most important thing with defending this way is how quickly you can empty the box on clearing the ball and how quickly you can get your shape back.

The other way, keeping players on the half way line, obviously means you have an outlet for a counter attack, but also means that if the other team has some good heading players, they are going to have more space to operate in and get on the end of a ball more cleanly. Have more space to run into and attack the ball and have a better chance of winning the ball. The key with this way is if you have defensive players who you know will win everything in the air or a goalie that will claim the ball and has good distribution then you are in the money!

I would say the first way is better defensively if you don't have the personel, but the second way is better if you have 3 or 4 defensive players at corners that you know will win the ball.

Personally I would leave 1 on the half way line. That way you have enough to flood the box and make it harder for the attacking team, but you would also have an outlet the hurry the defenders i the ball got cleared.

That's how I see it anyway. Personally when i'm playing at the weekends, I just hang around the edge of the box because I can't header the ball!
 

Yorkshire Blue

Super Moderator⭐
Staff member
Joined
Oct 27, 2003
Messages
36,401
Location
London
Not sure if this has been covered before? Anyway, what's people's take on defending corners? I've noticed that we tend to bring everyone back into and on the edge of the 18-yard box. For me, this is a bit of a crap tactic. It encourages the opposition team to pile more men forward and it allows for zero restbite should the ball be cleared, as it just come straight back in.

IMO we have to be leaving at least one, possibly two pacey players up by the halfway line. This inturn gives an outlet if/when the ball is cleared, plus means the opposition have to leave two, three possibly four players back to cover.

Discuss...

Have we two pacey players;)

There's an argument that we should encourage the opposition to pile more men forward, as they then just get in the way - the too many cooks spoil the broth argument.

To be honest, I'd be more keen in positioning players two or three players 25 yards out.

1. The ball is more often cleared into this sort of territory then the 50 yard clearance
2. 50 yard balls back into the box should be easy enough to deal with, it's the balls back in from 25-30 yards out which are much more dangerous
3. If players are positioned 25-30 yards out, they should be able to get forward quickly to close down anyway.
 

GBJ

The Font of all Knowledge from Russia⭐
Staff member
Joined
Nov 2, 2008
Messages
12,400
Location
Grays
There's an argument that we should encourage the opposition to pile more men forward, as they then just get in the way - the too many cooks spoil the broth argument.

That might happen in theory, however there is no guarentee that it won't work against us.

To be honest, I'd be more keen in positioning players two or three players 25 yards out.

1. The ball is more often cleared into this sort of territory then the 50 yard clearance
2. 50 yard balls back into the box should be easy enough to deal with, it's the balls back in from 25-30 yards out which are much more dangerous
3. If players are positioned 25-30 yards out, they should be able to get forward quickly to close down anyway.

I'd be happy enough with this. IMO it is imperitive that we have some form of outlet.
 

turkishm

Director
Joined
Feb 2, 2007
Messages
2,879
Location
Turkey
Whatever is best, im not sure, but i think we seem to be dealing with dead ball situations with our present defence far better than in the past.
 

Davros

The Whippet
Joined
Dec 5, 2003
Messages
8,387
the problem with having too many players (especially of an attacking nature) in the defensive box, is that they are a lot more likely to play someone onside should the ball be returned to the box once if the corner is initially cleared
 

Firestorm

Pedant
Joined
Oct 25, 2003
Messages
15,225
Location
Immersed in the accounts
To a degree, it does depend on how the attacking side work the corners as well. If they pile men forward then a calculated gamble of leaving on or two up may well reduce the effectiveness, however flooding the box with defenders will onlywork if thats wher the attackers are.

I know its a completly different level of the game , but when I ran a boys side I used to try and get them to stay outside the box on an attacking corner and not move (into pre agreed areas) until the kick was taken , some running in from a fairly deep position arriving late , it tended to add a bit of confusion in the defence as the defenders seemed to spend that bit more attention on the player and often loose track of the ball. Also moving players are harder to pick up.
A good strong run across the front of the keeper also had the added bonus of forcing the keeper to come further for a ball when initially it seemed (to him) to be a routine jump and catch.
 

Yorkshire Blue

Super Moderator⭐
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Joined
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Messages
36,401
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London
To a degree, it does depend on how the attacking side work the corners as well. If they pile men forward then a calculated gamble of leaving on or two up may well reduce the effectiveness, however flooding the box with defenders will onlywork if thats wher the attackers are.

I know its a completly different level of the game , but when I ran a boys side I used to try and get them to stay outside the box on an attacking corner and not move (into pre agreed areas) until the kick was taken , some running in from a fairly deep position arriving late , it tended to add a bit of confusion in the defence as the defenders seemed to spend that bit more attention on the player and often loose track of the ball. Also moving players are harder to pick up.
A good strong run across the front of the keeper also had the added bonus of forcing the keeper to come further for a ball when initially it seemed (to him) to be a routine jump and catch.

If we're talking about attacking corners, then I'd have my three best volleyers of a ball stationed at the edge of the box, ready to have a dig if the ball is only half-cleared.
 

Yorkshire Blue

Super Moderator⭐
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Thats a fair call, but in my example "best volleyers" is not a generally used phrase in npower league two!!!

Corrected.

Since Moussa's gone, there aren't exactly many budding Andy Sussexs, although after Friday that may be harsh on Granty.
 

Yorkshire Blue

Super Moderator⭐
Staff member
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Clohessy's very sound technically, too...

I believe the crossbar is still rattling at Dartford after Zaaboub's effort in pre-season, so that's Zaaboub, Clohessy and Grant as our three.

I think Corr is probably a decent volleyer, but we'd want him competing for the crosses (or at least distracting defenders from Bilel).
 

Firestorm

Pedant
Joined
Oct 25, 2003
Messages
15,225
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Immersed in the accounts
I believe the crossbar is still rattling at Dartford after Zaaboub's effort in pre-season, so that's Zaaboub, Clohessy and Grant as our three.

I think Corr is probably a decent volleyer, but we'd want him competing for the crosses (or at least distracting defenders from Bilel).

I have not seen Bilel yet but from the various accounts he sounds like would be an ideal player to attack the cross with a late run
 

Beefy

Life President
Joined
Oct 27, 2003
Messages
18,901
Location
Old Leigh
Not sure if this has been covered before? Anyway, what's people's take on defending corners? I've noticed that we tend to bring everyone back into and on the edge of the 18-yard box. For me, this is a bit of a crap tactic. It encourages the opposition team to pile more men forward and it allows for zero restbite should the ball be cleared, as it just come straight back in.

IMO we have to be leaving at least one, possibly two pacey players up by the halfway line. This inturn gives an outlet if/when the ball is cleared, plus means the opposition have to leave two, three possibly four players back to cover.

Discuss...

I leave two pacy men on the halfway line in Football Manager and I just narrowly lost to Real Madrid in the Champions League Final with Southend.

I rest my case.
 

EastStandBlue

Life President
Joined
May 29, 2005
Messages
15,485
I leave two pacy men on the halfway line in Football Manager and I just narrowly lost to Real Madrid in the Champions League Final with Southend.

I rest my case.

We should be able to score bagfulls from corners using FM tactical instructions...

Ryan Hall to take corners from both sides, aimed towards the far post.
Barry Corr to challenge the goalkeeper.
Bilel Moshni to attack the far post.
Grant, Clohessy and Zaaboub to stand outside the 18-yard box.

Using this method, I see no reason why we can't rape this League at a canter.
 

Jam_Man

Life President
Joined
Apr 7, 2005
Messages
25,545
Location
Southend
Not sure if this has been covered before? Anyway, what's people's take on defending corners? I've noticed that we tend to bring everyone back into and on the edge of the 18-yard box. For me, this is a bit of a crap tactic. It encourages the opposition team to pile more men forward and it allows for zero restbite should the ball be cleared, as it just come straight back in.

IMO we have to be leaving at least one, possibly two pacey players up by the halfway line. This inturn gives an outlet if/when the ball is cleared, plus means the opposition have to leave two, three possibly four players back to cover.

Discuss...

Even if you pull all your players back the opposition rarely leave less than 2 at the back anyway, and if you have one player up front theres pretty much zero chance of him getting hold of the ball in the event its cleared anyway.

I personally prefer one player left up front none the less but I see the logic in pulling everyone back.
 

Pak Power

Manager⭐
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Messages
2,133
Location
Judea
I remember Northampton Town coming to Roots Hall in the seventies, and they left 4 up-field when we had a corner. It was most effective, and we didin't know how to cope with it at all.
They left two wingers on the halfway line/touchline, and two strikers in the centre circle. I think we had 5 back marking at our corners. The goalkeeper claimed easily.

I think the game finished 4-4 was most entertaining, and from memory I think Northampton were at, or near the top of the league (old fourth division)
Appologies to the younger members, for being so old.
 
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